Careful Daddy, That's a Live One!

181. this ageism has to stop. i cannot believe people are so damn superficial that they are making a complete judgment of her character and integrity based soley on age. wow.. since when were people so classless and rude?

Posted at 4:51PM on Jun 20th 2008 by betty

182. 175. HOW DO YOU EXPECT ANYONE TO BELIEVE THAT A MEXICAN CAN WORK FOR A COUPLE BUCKS AN HOUR AND SUPPORT THEMSELVES WITHOUT ASSISTANCE? IN THIS DAY AND AGE IT'S IMPOSSIBLE UNLESS THEY PILE UP WITH A BUNCH OF AMIGOS IN A SMALL 1BR APARTMENT.
I THINK THE ONES YOU ARE SPEAKING OF THAT ACTUALLY ARE NOT ON WELFARE ARE THOSE THAT WORK IN AMERICA AND THEN HEAD RIGHT BACK TO THEIR SHANTY IN MEXICO AFTER 5PM.

Posted at 4:33PM on Jun 20th 2008 by BARRRR
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You don't know what you're talking about. I live in New York City, and there are thousands of Mexicans living here and working, and a majority of them are illegal. I know quite a few of them personally. It's typical for them to work 12 hours a day or more, sometimes at two or more jobs. Many of them make 5 to 10 dollars an hour off the books, which still works out to less than what it costs to hire someone legally at the same company for the same job.

And being in New York, they can't just run back to "shanties" in Mexico. They live here. They often pack 5 or more people into a small apartment in order to share the rent.

These people are fueling the local economy in a big way here. And by and large, they are NOT getting welfare.

And if you expand your view beyond Mexicans and look at all the illegal immigrants in NYC, you'll see that most of them are living this way, no matter what countries they are from. They work hard, they earn money, and they pay state and local taxes when they make purchases with the money that they earn.

I can't speak for other cities, but the mind-set here is that most of the working immigrants _want_ to learn English. Schools that teach English are thriving here. You see ads for them on all of the busses and subways. Every immigrant I have spoken to, and we're talking dozens, are _all_ trying to learn English, and they say that they recognize it as a way to get ahead and have better opportunities.

Maybe this is more of a New York attitude, and maybe in the Southwest is different. I don't know. But based on my experience, I think that the local economy would take a nosedive if there weren't so many of these people living and working.

Posted at 4:58PM on Jun 20th 2008 by NYC guy

183. "Many of them make 5 to 10 dollars an hour off the books, which still works out to less than what it costs to hire someone legally at the same company for the same job."

GEE, YOU EXPECT A NOSEDIVE OF THE ECONOMY IF THEY FOUND LEGAL WORK? HOW DO YOU THINK THE ECONOMY KEPT RUNNING BEFORE SO MANY ILLEGALS WERE WORKING FOR A COUPLE BUCKS AN HOUR? 5-10 AN HOUR IS A LOT FOR ILLEGAL WORK! SOUNDS LIKE BS TO ME!
IT'S PRETTY INTERESTING THAT YOU KNOW THEIR WELFARE STATUS TOO! WOW, YOU MUST BE GLUED TO THEIR ASS OR SOMETHING! IF THEY ARE REALLY GETTING PAID ALMOST THE SAME AMOUNT AN AMERICAN CITIZEN WOULD MAKE FOR THE SAME CRAP JOB, IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE AN "ECONOMIC DEALBREAKER" BUT IT DOES SOUND LIKE A "boss CHECKBOOK BREAKER" THOUGH. GEE, POOR BOSS CAN'T GIVE HIMSELF AN EXTRA BONUS TO BUY ANOTHER BMW? LET'S TAKE IT OUT ON AMERICAN CITIZENS AND LET THE ILLEGALS STEAL THEIR JOBS. OK THEN. GEE, ACCORDING TO YOU ALL MEXICANS ARE HARDWORKING INDIVIDUALS THAT DO NOT RELY ON WELFARE. KINDA INTERESTING THAT THEY DO TAKE UP MOST OF THE SPACE IN WELFARE OFFICES THOUGH, NOW ISN'T IT? BUT THEN AGAIN, YOU BASE AN OPINION ON AN EXPERIENCE WITH FIVE.. COUNT EM .... FFFFF IIII VVVVV EEEE MEXICANS! LOL!

Posted at 5:14PM on Jun 20th 2008 by BARRRR

184. My husband was able to hold our daughter long before I was able to. He wasn't scared...he was up to the task and had all the enthusiasm in the world. Me on the other hand was scared to hold her. I had a difficult delivery and had a very high fever prompting the docs to perform a c-section. The fever caused me to shake uncontrollably and because of that even though I was in the hospital bed I wouldn't hold her when they tried to hand her to me when they were taking me back to my room.

And for whomever was saying that us normal people only get a day in the hospital you get to stay longer when you have a c-section. That is the only reason why she would be in the OR. Believe me...I would have much rather been kicked out the next day...I wouldn't have as much in medical bills!

Posted at 5:14PM on Jun 20th 2008 by jamie

185. Considering Jamie's situation, I think she has handled the whole pregnancy thing very well. She was more or less
on top of the world at age 16/17 as the star of her own show. She could of stayed in California and hung out at
Mr. Chows and been stalked by the paps. She chose to move back to Louisiana and try and lead a somewhat
normal life. Why she has not sold pictures of her baby to the highest bidder is beyond me. Not many people
have a chance to sell their baby's pics for a couple of hundred thousand dollars and she would be foolish not
to do it.

Posted at 5:29PM on Jun 20th 2008 by fishfeedfive

186. 181. "Many of them make 5 to 10 dollars an hour off the books, which still works out to less than what it costs to hire someone legally at the same company for the same job."

GEE, YOU EXPECT A NOSEDIVE OF THE ECONOMY IF THEY FOUND LEGAL WORK? HOW DO YOU THINK THE ECONOMY KEPT RUNNING BEFORE SO MANY ILLEGALS WERE WORKING FOR A COUPLE BUCKS AN HOUR? 5-10 AN HOUR IS A LOT FOR ILLEGAL WORK! SOUNDS LIKE BS TO ME!
...
Posted at 5:14PM on Jun 20th 2008 by BARRRR
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The New York mimimum wage is 7.15/hour. The employer has to pay Social Security, state unemployment insurance premiums of several thousand dollars a year per employee, workman's comp insurance for even more than that, and various and sundry other taxes and fees. The average on-the-books minimum wage worker costs the employer more than 11 dollars an hour here.

People getting 5-10 dollars an hour off the books still cost less than that. Furthermore, there are requirements to pay legal empolyees time-and-a-half for any time exceeding 40 hours a week, and there are rules and regulations concerning working conditions. None of those stipluations or rules apply to off-the-books workers, so the employers avoid hassles and bureaucracy and save even more money by hiring these people, especially when they are putting in 12-hour days.

Also, there is so much of this off-the-books work in New York that employers actually have to compete for the workers, which is why the wages got driven up to the 5-10/hour range for these illegal workers in the first place.

Your comments about the boss' checkbooks are right on. But just remember that if the bosses didn't see an economic advantage (whether they're greedy or just trying to keep their business afloat), they wouldn't hire these people. And if the bosses didn't offer these jobs in the first place, the workers wouldn't flock here to get them. So I agree with the other posters who say that the blame for this is on the Amercan businesses who hire these people in the first place.

Also, New York has lots of "Ma and Pa" businesses that are barely making ends meet. Lots of these businesses rely on off-the-books workers, and some would go under if the owners had to hire legal workers at minimum wage. I'm not saying that this is right, but it's an economic fact here.

Also, there are lots and lots of restaurants, bars, and clubs in New York, and these are businesses which normally run on a tiny profit margin. The majority of them have illegal workers on the payroll. Construction businesses have a somewhat higher profit margin, but they too rely on illegals, because they are avoiding not only the government regulations, but also, the unions, who have driven the base salaries up even higher.

You can argue that any business that needs to hire illegals to stay afloat doesn't deserve to be in business. Lots of people would agree with you, but at the same time, these businesses are still here and they still hire the illegals. And their owners support political candidates who represent their interests.

You may not _want_ to believe that this is going on to such a great extent in our country, but you can't change reality simply by desiring it to be other than it is.

Posted at 6:04PM on Jun 20th 2008 by NYC guy

187. 182. Considering Jamie's situation, I think she has handled the whole pregnancy thing very well. She was more or less
on top of the world at age 16/17 as the star of her own show. She could of stayed in California and hung out at
Mr. Chows and been stalked by the paps. She chose to move back to Louisiana and try and lead a somewhat
normal life. Why she has not sold pictures of her baby to the highest bidder is beyond me. Not many people
have a chance to sell their baby's pics for a couple of hundred thousand dollars and she would be foolish not
to do it.

Posted at 5:29PM on Jun 20th 2008 by fishfeedfive

I agree that Jamie Lynn seems to be handling things reasonably well.

As for selling the baby pictures, her mom has already negotiated a first-baby-pics spread with OK magazine. I don't know what she's getting for this, although I seem to remember that she got a million from that magazine for the exclusive debut story about Jamie Lynn's pregnancy, and it might be the case that this money also covers the first-baby-pics exclusive.

Posted at 6:23PM on Jun 20th 2008 by poiuyt

188. Good for Jamie for getting some cash from OK magazine. Although, I hope this does not start a trend where
girls who are somewhat well known decide to get pregnant just so they can cash in on the baby pictures. I know it
might sound ridiculous. but when a person is 17 or 18 and they have a chance to get $500,0000 for some pictures
of a baby, you never know what people will do. People risk going to jail for up to 10 years for robbing a convenience
store and getting less than $100.

Posted at 7:17PM on Jun 20th 2008 by fishfeedfive

189. what bothers me the most is that some doctor did an elective c/section on her at 17, so that she wouldn't have to go thru labor. A totally unnecessary surgery but also, don't you think it might be good for the knocked up teenager to have some consequences...Shouldn't the doctor know better???

Posted at 10:16PM on Jun 20th 2008 by Stef

190. To show just how dishonest and hypocritical Harvey Levin is for harping on this "unwed teen mother" theme, consider the following facts:

- Almost four out of ten children now being born in the U.S. are coming into the world out of wedlock: http://marriage.rutgers.edu/Publications/SOOU/TEXTSOOU2007.htm

- Starting in 2006, more than half of the children of mothers under 30 in the U.S. are being born out of wedlock: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/21/opinion/21herbert.html

If you look at Jamie Lynn and Casey, they are at least setting up a home together and living as a family with their baby, which is a lot better than what happens in lots of cases, where one parent (usually the father) abandons the family and other parent is forced to raise the child alone.

So, the fact that Harvey is ignoring the millions of unwed mothers in the U.S. and just keeps vilifying Jamie Lynn shows that he has nothing more than an obsessed, mean-spirited, hate-filled vendetta against her.

Furthermore, I believe that Harvey _wants_ to see Jamie Lynn and her baby suffer, and that he would laugh with glee at every moment of pain that either of them might go through. And I wouldn't put it past him to want to aid and abet their suffering, if the opportunity arises.

Posted at 11:39AM on Jun 21st 2008 by Harvey Levin is a pathetic excuse for a human being

191. This is what happens to TRASHY AMERICANS and DIRTY IMMIGRANTS who shop at Walmart and don't listen to their Lord ALMIGHTY! Trash is damned to hell.

Posted at 7:58PM on Jun 21st 2008 by sue ann

192. 187, are you saying that it is a doctor's job to inflict punishment onto his/her patients? Wow. She has enough money to elect for a C-section, so that is her right to do so. If you want one woman's rights taken away just to amuse you, then we should continue with your rights next.

Posted at 8:03PM on Jun 21st 2008 by patty

193. 187. what bothers me the most is that some doctor did an elective c/section on her at 17, so that she wouldn't have to go thru labor. A totally unnecessary surgery but also, don't you think it might be good for the knocked up teenager to have some consequences...Shouldn't the doctor know better???

Posted at 10:16PM on Jun 20th 2008 by Stef

Learn to read, Stef. It's all over the news that Jamie Lynn had a C-section because the baby was in a breech position. This is a more risky position for the baby to be in, and it's a fairly standard medical procedure to do a C-section in this case.

Posted at 8:55AM on Jun 22nd 2008 by Learn to use your brain while you're at it.

194. 190. This is what happens to TRASHY AMERICANS and DIRTY IMMIGRANTS who shop at Walmart and don't listen to their Lord ALMIGHTY! Trash is damned to hell.

Posted at 7:58PM on Jun 21st 2008 by sue ann
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I don't recall there being an 11th Commandment that states, "Thou shalt not shop at Walmart".

Posted at 8:57AM on Jun 22nd 2008 by You're an idiot

195. It is absolutely amazing how many perfect people there are in the world and how many of them comment on this. wow. It is called LIFE. Quit living in the 1980s and realize that there are even younger people having babies. I give her credit for keeping the baby and starting afamily at such a young age. I know I couldnt do it at 21. do your thing and let her do hers.

Posted at 4:39PM on Jun 22nd 2008 by Andrea