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Conrad Murray - Michael Was Alive at UCLA

3/30/2010 10:00 AM PDT BY TMZ STAFF

TMZ has learned doctors who worked on Michael Jackson at the UCLA Medical Center ran two EKGs on the singer, and at least one doctor who interpreted the results claims there was heart rhythmic activity both times.

Michael Jackson and Dr. Conrad Murray
Furthermore, sources tell TMZ Dr. Conrad Murray insists he was able to restart Jackson's heart at the singer's home before paramedics arrived and then maintained heart activity in the ambulance.

Dr. Murray's evaluation contradicts paramedics at the scene who wanted to take Jackson to the morgue, not UCLA, because they believed he was dead.

It also contradicts Joe Jackson's lawyer, Brian Oxman, who tells TMZ he believes Jackson was dead even before paramedics arrived at the house. Oxman says the weak pulse detected at UCLA was in reaction to resuscitation efforts.

We're told the criminal case is shaping up as a legal war between medical experts, who will be interpreting medical tests and charts in various ways -- always confusing for a jury.

549 COMMENTS

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61.

Barb    

Thank you janalal4 for answering my question.

====================
Yes, Barb your correct. I can't imagine anything WORSE than the situation as it exists now(Michael Jackson being dead) than if he were laying in some ICU with a heartbeat & no brain activity. How horrible & NO WAY would he have wanted THAT!

So, had Murray performed CPR properly, called 911 sooner, not interrupted CPR to hide evidence then perhaps there could have been a very different outcome?! I really don't understand WHAT this quacks 'defense' could possibly be if he chooses to go to trial.

Posted at 8:26AM on Mar 30th 2010 by janalal4

1577 days ago
62.

tis_ruthy    

YES, MJ I believed asked several doctors & it is my opinion he probably 'settled for' Murray because nobody else would do it. I think MJ probably had used Diprivan MANY times with other doctors & had never had any problems. I think MJ trusted ANY doctor far too much. Why would MJ do this? Because he spoke of suffering from chronic insomnia ALL his life. Was he desperate? Absolutely. Would he take a chance with his life? Absolutely. Insomnia or drug abuse will find a way to make you 'think' that what you are doing is perfectly 'okay' if you are desperate ENOUGH.



I disagree Janala, I don't think he would risk his life to that degree. He was always scared that someone would take his life over the beatles catalogue.. yet hed risk it every night lol .. bit of a conflict of interests there me thinks. Lack of sleep can cause anxiety... umm me thinks risking your life would just make you a litle bit more anxious. I really, truly believe that the addiction to propofol scenario is ridiculous and just completely contradicts everything that Michael believed in. Justice for Michael people shouting how dare you say he would hoax his death, how could he do that to his children .. yet you so readily believe hed risk his life everyyyyyyyyyy singleeeeeeeeeeee day lol...

1577 days ago
63.

janalal4    

130. YES, MJ I believed asked several doctors & it is my opinion he probably 'settled for' Murray because nobody else would do it. I think MJ probably had used Diprivan MANY times with other doctors & had never had any problems. I think MJ trusted ANY doctor far too much. Why would MJ do this? Because he spoke of suffering from chronic insomnia ALL his life. Was he desperate? Absolutely. Would he take a chance with his life? Absolutely. Insomnia or drug abuse will find a way to make you 'think' that what you are doing is perfectly 'okay' if you are desperate ENOUGH.



I disagree Janala, I don't think he would risk his life to that degree. He was always scared that someone would take his life over the beatles catalogue.. yet hed risk it every night lol .. bit of a conflict of interests there me thinks. Lack of sleep can cause anxiety... umm me thinks risking your life would just make you a litle bit more anxious. I really, truly believe that the addiction to propofol scenario is ridiculous and just completely contradicts everything that Michael believed in. Justice for Michael people shouting how dare you say he would hoax his death, how could he do that to his children .. yet you so readily believe hed risk his life everyyyyyyyyyy singleeeeeeeeeeee day lol...

Posted at 9:52AM on Mar 30th 2010 by tis_ruthy



Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2010/03/30/conrad-murray-michael-jackson-heart-ekg-paramedics-ucla-medical-center-wrongful-death/9#comments#ixzz0jfTyYd7I

Believing someone would take your life over a business deal does not mean that you feel the same about physicians. Let's face it. MJ had lots of 'experience' with physicians over the years & it doesn't seems that anything really 'bad' had happened to him at their hand. I think when it came to the medical profession, if you had M.D. behind your name, MJ most likely would have trusted you 'enough' to think that if he paid ENOUGH MONEY then he would get from you, the 'BEST CARE'. Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way. What you will get is the 'greediest' individual, not necessarily the most qualified. And yes.....MJ would have probably reasoned with himself that 'it'll be okay' because he was just that desperate & believed he NEEDED this 'treatment'. It's called DENIAL & it is a very powerful force. It will make you 'do' things & 'think' things that normally your rational mind would not even consider to be appropriate.

1577 days ago
64.

janalal4    

129. Thank you janalal4 for answering my question.

====================
Yes, Barb your correct. I can't imagine anything WORSE than the situation as it exists now(Michael Jackson being dead) than if he were laying in some ICU with a heartbeat & no brain activity. How horrible & NO WAY would he have wanted THAT!

So, had Murray performed CPR properly, called 911 sooner, not interrupted CPR to hide evidence then perhaps there could have been a very different outcome?! I really don't understand WHAT this quacks 'defense' could possibly be if he chooses to go to trial.

Posted at 8:26AM on Mar 30th 2010 by janalal4



Posted at 9:50AM on Mar 30th 2010 by Barb



Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2010/03/30/conrad-murray-michael-jackson-heart-ekg-paramedics-ucla-medical-center-wrongful-death/9#c26687509#ixzz0jfVVLe5j

Your very welcome Barb:)

1577 days ago
65.

menocomprendo    

Everytime the drama is about to be solve, something new pops up in the news and we're back to the start. I'm really thinking about the hoax possibility now. I mean, come on! We're not stupid! That Michael Jackson thing is too weird from the beginning and now it's getting worse. It becomes a joke. Doctors can't even agree on the condition of MJ. I don't know what to think anymore about the whole thing. He might be dead for real but I would not be surprised if he were still alive. In my head it's like fifty-fifty.

1577 days ago
66.

tis_ruthy    

Denial is a very good word Janala, I appreciate your views. It is a constant.

Anyways will we ever know what Michael truly thinks..his thoughts you can never tell...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXgim4YXLXk

1577 days ago
67.

MiMi    

Definition of Desperate Recklessness:

"the trait of giving little thought to danger"

Michael was desperate for rest. Research sleep disorders and you will see how terrible of an infliction this can be. Add on top of that that you are the most recognizable performer on the planet who is about to embark on a major comeback concert tour.

The man was about to perform 50 concerts and possible a world tour. In his eyes the propofol was the only way to achieve rest. Now had he previously had reputable doctors & minders in his life, this scenerio might have never taken place.

1577 days ago
68.

janalal4    

128. All of you saying "Michael would never do that to his family and his fans."

How do you know? Nobody knows what goes on behind closed doors. You think just because you are a fan that you know what he thinks? No you don't. None of us do!

And we are not 'accusing' Michael of being a liar and a faker and we certainly don't think it's just some sort of joke or that he did it for a comeback. Is it really incomprehensible to think that he could have had no choice but to do this if he had received a very serious death threat (or his family had) and now has to appear 'dead' until the perpetrators of the threat are caught?? He could be in a witness protection program for all we know.

It could be something that none of us will ever comprehend.



Posted at 9:53AM on Mar 30th 2010 by RowdyAngel



Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2010/03/30/conrad-murray-michael-jackson-heart-ekg-paramedics-ucla-medical-center-wrongful-death/9#c26687598#ixzz0jfW1fwzG

Please don't misunderstand. I don't think I 'knew' MJ personally but only believe that this sort of behavior was not who he 'demonstrated himself to be' throughout his life. That is honestly all ANY of us have to go on. We don't 'know him' any better than you do. I just judge him based on who he seemed to be in life & that sort of behavior just doesn't seem to 'fit'. I think thats all any of us who don't believe the whole 'hoax' scenario are saying. He 'valued' people too much. As someone said above, he didn't flee & 'hide' during that trial. Why would someone with such a good 'character' as MJ do such a thing & why would anyone JUSTIFY this behavior on his behalf??

I know that 'I' am only 'one fan' but personally MJ would have some serious 'splaining to do':)

1577 days ago
69.

menocomprendo    

I agree with Posted at 9:53AM on Mar 30th 2010 by RowdyAngel

Things about MJ and the FBI were out after Michael's "death" and it is possible that MJ had serious life threats, so that would explain the hole thing. Maybe Micheal wanted to give hints to his fans that he 's still alive so he decided to make a sort of "movie" about it, instead of doing nothing but hiding himself. I don't know but it's quite possible. Otherwise, I don't get it. What would be the point of faking his death? Very bizarre.

1577 days ago
70.

janalal4    

135. Denial is a very good word Janala, I appreciate your views. It is a constant.

Anyways will we ever know what Michael truly thinks..his thoughts you can never tell...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXgim4YXLXk

Posted at 10:04AM on Mar 30th 2010 by tis_ruthy



Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2010/03/30/conrad-murray-michael-jackson-heart-ekg-paramedics-ucla-medical-center-wrongful-death/9#comments#ixzz0jfYFFAKT

Someone as 'complex' as MJ?? I agree, we may NEVER know what he thought. However, if your dealing with something as equally complex as a 'sleep disorder' or an 'addiction' we certainly shouldn't discount the possibility that MJ would have acted in an irrational, seemingly 'fool-hearty' manner.

1577 days ago
71.

Zig Zag    

The plot thickens!

Didn't the paramedics say MJ already had livor mortis setting in by the time they arrived? You can't be alive and have livor mortis.

1577 days ago
72.

MiMi    

Was Michael Jackson Part of the Cause and Clearly the Victim of a Perverted Doctor-Patient Relationship?


"The death of Michael Jackson was both unnecessary and deeply troubling. The thought of a well-trained cardiologist divorcing himself from the realm of sanity and performing general anesthesia in someone's bedroom defies words. This rogue physician's lack of integrity cost a man his life, his family a loved one and the world a prodigy.

Unfortunately these actions underscore a potentially dangerous and far too common trend occurring in doctor's offices throughout America: patient-mandated care."


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/johnny-benjamin/was-michael-jackson-part_b_463496.html

I am all for patient education and the benefits of the internet but there is an appropriate manner in which to utilize this information. Direct marketing of drugs, procedures and surgical implants to patients has significantly altered the doctor-patient relationship and the dynamics of the interaction.

It is virtually impossible to watch the evening news without being bombarded with the latest celebrity endorsed osteoporosis drug. Watching the TV commercials during a major sporting event is far better than an actual office visit to diagnose and treat one's erectile dysfunction. And if the erection lasts more than 4 hours, consider yourself blessed!

A person walking into a doctor's office and demanding various treatments and/or medications often before the doctor has completed their greeting is a common example of what I call patient mandated care. "Hello Mr. Smith, I'm Dr. Benjamin. I understand...yeah nice to meet you doc. I'm here for some pain medication". No history and physical examination, no review of prior treatment or medications, just give me what I want.

Information is empowering and useful. A patient demanding specific care is potentially dangerous and often a tremendous waste of resources. Truly, a version of this scenario plays out everyday in virtually every doctor's office in America.

The correct answer is for the physician to merely say no; many do, which invariably sparks a confrontation. It only takes one doctor to acquiesce and take the easy road and write that prescription, order that unnecessary test or perform that procedure.

Unfortunately, as in the case of Michael Jackson, the world has painfully learned how horribly wrong the perverted doctor patient relationship can go. The moral to this story is to be very careful of what you demand and beg for in a doctor's office, because you may be just one questionable physician away from serious heartache and pain."

1577 days ago
73.

V    

Rhythmic activity doesn't mean anything unless it was synchronized regular rhythm that is to say the heart is working properly and pumping oxygenated blood to vital tissues. You can have a disorganized rhythm (electrical activity) where the heart is quivering but not enough blood is not being adequately pump out to be of any benefit.

1577 days ago
74.

trish    

He ALIVE ya'll..HE ALIVE..

1577 days ago
75.

kimberly    

@#28. If this is true, then Michael Jackson never planned on the comeback tour performances. A "concert movie" had been planned and was in the making. This is very interesting.

What also interests me is that the court dates are being held on holidays.

I smell a rat.

1577 days ago
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